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 by Ramsdude
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   356  
 Joined:  May 22 2018
United States of America   Pa.
Starter

Seeing the article about Spags wanting to be a HC again, got me thinking. Who was the worst HC in Rams history and who was the best? With such a long glorious history, I am sure there are many good choices.

As for the Worst HC in my lifetime, it would be tough to decide between Spags and Linehan. Spags teams were SOOOO bad and Linehan lost the team and also let Ike Bruce go!

Spags was such a little douche dictator who suffered from "little man syndrome" or "Napoleon complex" fielded some pretty bad teams. We almost went 0-16 with him. His overall record was .208 and Scottie Linehan was .306.

My vote goes to Spags!

My vote for best HC (in my lifetime) goes to Martz\Vermeil. I have to go with both because IMO it was BOTH TOGETHER that got us our SB trophy. I don't think either was as good without the other.

Thoughts???


Code: Select all                                                                       
                                                                    Play
Coach               From   To   G  W  L T W-L% G plyf W plyf L plyf Chmp
Sean McVay          2017 2019  48 33 15 0 .688      4      2      2    0
John Fassel         2016 2016   3  0  3 0 .000      0      0      0    0
Jeff Fisher         2012 2016  77 31 45 1 .409      0      0      0    0
Steve Spagnuolo     2009 2011  48 10 38 0 .208      0      0      0    0
Jim Haslett         2008 2008  12  2 10 0 .167      0      0      0    0
Scott Linehan       2006 2008  36 11 25 0 .306      0      0      0    0
Joe Vitt            2005 2005  11  4  7 0 .364      0      0      0    0
Mike Martz          2000 2005  85 53 32 0 .624      7      3      4    0
Dick Vermeil        1997 1999  48 22 26 0 .458      3      3      0    1
Rich Brooks         1995 1996  32 13 19 0 .406      0      0      0    0
Chuck Knox          1973 1994 118 69 48 1 .589      8      3      5    0
John Robinson       1983 1991 143 75 68 0 .524     10      4      6    0
Ray Malavasi        1978 1982  73 40 33 0 .548      6      3      3    0
Tommy Prothro       1971 1972  28 14 12 2 .537      0      0      0    0
George Allen+       1966 1970  70 49 17 4 .742      2      0      2    0
Harland Svare       1962 1965  48 14 31 3 .311      0      0      0    0
Bob Waterfield+     1960 1962  34  9 24 1 .273      0      0      0    0
Sid Gillman+        1955 1959  60 28 31 1 .475      1      0      1    0
Hampton Pool        1952 1954  35 23 10 2 .697      1      0      1    0
Joe Stydahar+       1950 1952  25 17  8 0 .680      3      2      1    1
Clark Shaughnessy   1948 1949  24 14  7 3 .667      1      0      1    0
Bob Snyder          1947 1947  12  6  6 0 .500      0      0      0    0
Adam Walsh          1945 1946  21 15  5 1 .750      1      1      0    1
Aldo Donelli        1944 1944  10  4  6 0 .400      0      0      0    0
Dutch Clark+        1939 1942  44 16 26 2 .381      0      0      0    0
Hugo Bezdek         1937 1938  14  1 13 0 .071      0      0      0    0
Art Lewis           1938 1938   8  4  4 0 .500      0      0      0    0

 by Hacksaw
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   16465  
 Joined:  Apr 15 2015
United States of America   AT THE BEACH
Moderator

Worst has to be Spagnuolo.
Bezdek and Hasslett's % are low but have a small sample size. Of course that sample size might not be an accident

My personal fav and #1 in my book was George Allen. McV is growing on me though, lol.

Malavasi did take us to a chip so I have a warm fuzzy for Ray too.

If Robinson didn't have ED methinks that might have gone a lot worse.

 by /zn/
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   4811  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Superstar

On my watch? (Since the 70s).

2 worst--Brooks and Linehan.

(Spags is in the running except his entire team was carpet bombed with injuries in 2011, including things like starting 10 different CBs, and also having what Football Outsiders identified as the single most injured up offense since 2002. Why 2002? That's as far back as they looked. I don't think he was ready to be a head coach but 2011 gutted the team, so I give him a pass for that.)

2 best--Vermeil and McVay

 by Hacksaw
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   16465  
 Joined:  Apr 15 2015
United States of America   AT THE BEACH
Moderator

Vermiel was certainly able to put 1 top notch staff together. He was also at the helm when the team won their 'chip'.
But iirc, his teams didn't do well until MM came along. Even the brass agreed when MM threatened to leave if not promoted to HC.
Disclaimer: This info has been verified by friends of mine in STL who are also personal friends and family with MM.

 by /zn/
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   4811  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Superstar

Hacksaw wrote:Vermiel was certainly able to put 1 top notch staff together. He was also at the helm when the team won their 'chip'.
But iirc, his teams didn't do that well until MM came along. Even the brass agreed when MM threatened to leave if not promoted to HC.
Disclaimer: This info has been verified by friends of mine in STL who are also personal friends and family with MM.


Vermeil rebuilt a team from scratch. Martz did well as long as he had Vermeil's team, which deteriorated under him (though a lot of that was Zygmunt).

I stand by the view that as good as Martz was, any good coordinator would have won with the combination of that OL, Warner/Green, Holt & Bruce etc, and Faulk.

Plus of course in 99 that defense was ranked 6th overall, 4th in points.

Given all that Martz was not the only difference between 98 and 99. As said--completely rebuilding the OL, Banks replaced with 1 good and 1 great option, Bruce healthy, adding Holt and Faulk....that's a lot.

 by R4L
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   992  
 Joined:  May 08 2017
United States of America   Dayton, Ohio
Veteran

Good post my friend. I see it's being trolled already :lol2: .

The worst has to be Spags, followed closely by Linehan.

The best to me were John Robinson and Martz. I don't put McVay on that list yet.

 by Hacksaw
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   16465  
 Joined:  Apr 15 2015
United States of America   AT THE BEACH
Moderator

/zn/ wrote:Vermeil rebuilt a team from scratch. Martz did well as long as he had Vermeil's team, which deteriorated under him (though a lot of that was Zygmunt).

I stand by the view that as good as Martz was, any good coordinator would have won with the combination of that OL, Warner/Green, Holt & Bruce etc, and Faulk.

Plus of course in 99 that defense was ranked 6th overall, 4th in points.

Given all that Martz was not the only difference between 98 and 99. As said--completely rebuilding the OL, Banks replaced with 1 good and 1 great option, Bruce healthy, adding Holt and Faulk....that's a lot.

OK he built a decent team. High draft pick from Brooks and DV's last place finishes didn't hurt that cause either.
Don't get me wrong, I always liked Vermiel, but the win column during his tenure in horns was not his finest, , until HE hired MM.

1.JPG

 by PARAM
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   4305  
 Joined:  Jul 15 2015
Barbados   Just far enough North of Philadelphia
Superstar

I have a hard time picking the absolute worst Rams coach I've seen. A lot of old timers point to Prothro but he ended his 2 year stint with a winning record so how bad could he have been? Of course in his second season he had us sitting at 5-2-1 but lost 5 of the last 6. Still, I can't give it to him considering the other duds we've had.

Rich Brooks, Scott Linehan and Chuck Knox II would be my pick....pick any of them and I'd agree. Spagnuolo for all his inexperience, his four pillars and his ineptness had us 1 last game of the year win away from the postseason. A lot of jokes were made of that view at the time but how close did Brooks, Linehan or Knox have us to the postseason?

Best coach? Well hell Vermeil has to be in the running doesn't he, regardless of whether Martz was the difference or not? And of course Martz has to be up there too. For all his misuse of timeouts, which in my opinion were way overblown, he had the Rams crushing teams. There was no letup either, as there shouldn't be. Just ask Jet fans.

Allen, Knox I, Malavasi and Robinson were all excellent but each had their warts they couldn't overcome. And the guy we have right now, might end up being the best by far. But that's down the road a bit.

If I have to pick one of each, Vermeil for obvious reasons and Brooks.

 by /zn/
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   4811  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Superstar

Hacksaw wrote:but the win column during his tenure in horns was not his finest, , until HE hired MM.


Which is what happens with rebuilds.

In terms of what he inherited from Brooks, in the end the guys left from the Brooks drafts on the 99 team were Miller and Carter. That's it. One 5th round pick, one first round pick. Granted that Conwell was injured, but, if you look at the 1st 3 rounds of the 95 & 96 drafts, that's 9 high picks and they ended up with only 2 left. So no he did not inherit anything.

In fact go back to 1990. In the first 3 rounds from 90 to 96, that's 26 high picks. Out of those 26 the 99 Rams had 3 of them still on the roster--Lyght, Bruce, and Carter. Granted some of those lost were injuries (Wright, Lyle, Conwell).

That was a 2-year rebuild--which not only hit on draft picks, high and low, but also on UDFAs, free agents, trades, and picked-up cuts from other teams.

Again. I have always said that you hire any good coordinator for that 99 team and they win.

I think it IS a coincidence that it was Martz, though obviously he was a good addition. I think it is NO coincidence that a team with that roster was winning in 99.

...

 by Hacksaw
2 weeks ago
 Total posts:   16465  
 Joined:  Apr 15 2015
United States of America   AT THE BEACH
Moderator

/zn/ wrote:Which is what happens with rebuilds.

In terms of what he inherited from Brooks, in the end the guys left from the Brooks drafts on the 99 team were Miller and Carter. That's it. One 5th round pick, one first round pick. Granted that Conwell was injured, but, if you look at the 1st 3 rounds of the 95 & 96 drafts, that's 9 high picks and they ended up with only 2 left. So no he did not inherit anything.

In fact go back to 1990. In the first 3 rounds from 90 to 96, that's 26 high picks. Out of those 26 the 99 Rams had 3 of them still on the roster--Lyght, Bruce, and Carter. Granted some of those lost were injuries (Wright, Lyle, Conwell).

That was a 2-year rebuild--which not only hit on draft picks, high and low, but also on UDFAs, free agents, trades, and picked-up cuts from other teams.

Again. I have always said that you hire any good coordinator for that 99 team and they win.

I think it IS a coincidence that it was Martz, though obviously he was a good addition. I think it is NO coincidence that a team with that roster was winning in 99.

...

Let's save our thumbs and agree to disagree here.

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27 posts Feb 28 2020